Community Forum changes - What would you like to see?

[squamish climber]

I'm thinking of making some modifications to the Community Forum such as adding more categories like Bouldering, Wall Climbing and Alpine. I'm also considering getting rid of the rank gif (the graphic that goes from monkey to ape to human) What do people think? What other suggestions do you have?

By the way, a couple of small things. The red feedback tag on the left side of the page is where you can also make suggestions. I've corrected a couple of things noted there including updating the web cam link and fixing the link to Wiretap. Stay tuned for additional improvements.

Keep the ideas coming and hopefully we can make this community meeting place even better.

[Optimally-Primed]

Thanks for asking for our suggestions. I think that the Forum plays an important role in the Squamish community. Keep it up!

My main suggestion is something I suggested to your predecessor: I think that anonymity is a curse on this forum. Slander seems to be easier to dish out when one's name isn't attached to it. We wouldn't act that way in person but the white screen seems to give us permission to act in ways that are inappropriate and destructive. My suggestion is that users use their real names.

As Rolf put it, when we route developers put up a new line, we and our actions are in full public view and susceptible to scrutiny; I for one believe that the critics ought to be held equally to account.

Jeremy Frimer

[Fre]

Totally fair, anonymity is lame
Frederik Vermote

[Tricouni]

I agree: get rid of the anonymity. If people have strong opinions, fine, but let's see who's behind the opinions.

Glenn Woodsworth

[hafilax]

And how do you guys propose enforcing this rule? Why do you care so much what somebody you don't know has to say?

[Tricouni]

And how do you guys propose enforcing this rule? Why do you care so much what somebody you don't know has to say?

I don't know how to enforce it. But I do know that if a site asks for a real name and someone lies about that, then when the lie comes out, I won't believe anything that person has to say. I don't "care" what someone I don't know has to say, but I might (or not) find it interesting. I was taught to stand behind my opinions with my real name.

Glenn

[gearheart]

I would like to see a specific ride-share page.
Todd

[Optimally-Primed]

And how do you guys propose enforcing this rule? Why do you care so much what somebody you don't know has to say?

I heard that a site out in the Rockies was having similar troubles as this site, with ranting zealots controlling the airwaves. What I heard is that the site administrator outed the ranters by revealing their true identity. They quickly silenced themselves. The Squamish community isn't as big as it may seem. It's hard to hide in such a small place. Come out come out wherever you are, ranting zealots...

[hafilax]

Which is better, having people talk behind your back without you hearing, or facing anonymous critics as little dots on the screen?

IMO demanding that people prove their identities to participate here would stifle the addition of new users. The cons would outweigh the pros.

I've had lots of people ask me who I am through PM on other boards and have no problem letting them know. I've even met a few IRL but that doesn't mean that I want to sign my name to every post.

[squamish climber]

This is a great discussion and one well worth having. I have to admit I was not expecting to get into a debate about the whole anonymity of the Internet when I was looking for suggestions on changes.

I mean that's one of the biggest problems about the Net -- anybody can hide behind a mask and even if you ask them not to, they can still give a fake name. Unfortunately Internet anonymity makes it easier for anyone who wants to be a jerk to be one. Fortunately, the consequences for being a jerk either in a virtual setting or in a real one are about the same. Folks will avoid you and won't take you seriously...until you admit you stepped over the line, then in most cases all can be forgotten.

The flip side is that everything you say is tracked and stored on the Internet. Some people are worried that future potential employers will google them and not hire them based on words that may have been written during momentary lapses of reason.

I agree that we should post with our real names, but I also agree with Hafilax that this might discourage the addition of new users. Anonymity provides some safety from getting your head bitten off. I've noticed that the longer people have been on the community forum the less concerned they are with remaining anonymous. Hopefully that will continue.

Here's one suggestion. We could boost the moderation on the forum. There are clear rules on the kind of posts that are not allowed. Less clear is how a successive posts viewed together can have a cumulative effect as being slanderous and malicious. Stepping in earlier and informing that person in a pm could avoid some of these situations.

Dave Jones

[J Mace]

future potential employers will google them

And find out you like to climb rock and ice in your spare time, sounds like a great way to increase sick/injured days...whether its true or not could affect your employment.

What happens if your work is public ? Then your views of whatever are brought to your work environment?

People in general say things par for the course and those that dont can be dealth with on a individual basis, no need for real names.

[Anders Ourom]

An intermediate step might be to require that all posters identify themselves when creating an account and password, but only to the administrators. That is, provide a verifiable name, address, and telephone. The discipline of knowing that someone knows who you really are, someone who can control whether or not you're permitted to post, might be helpful, and it might not take a lot of work to set it up. Noting that site revenues go up with number of visits and posts, amongst other things, without heed to the quality (or not) of posts.

The solution that Tricouni and Optimus Prime - sorry, Glenn and Jeremy - have adopted also has some merit. Use a pen name, but make clear whenever it's important who's really talking. It's then a little less obvious to outsiders (google) who's here, and saying what.

If you follow most climbing forums for a while, it doesn't take long to catch on to who many of the people really are.

[Cloudraker]

I see nothing wrong with internet forum anonymity. But I haven't had my day ruined by the scrutiny of malicious internet zealots hiding behind their monitors in their mom's basements. And in fact I must have entirely missed the new route thread(s) mentioned in the above posts.

For me, revealing my name would serve absolutely no purpose. In fact it would restrict my visits here. This isn't an archive resource like bivouac.com where the use of real names serves an important purpose, this is an internet forum where I like to think I can exercise some modicum of free speech and jack-assery.

Sounds like you guys want to take this in a different direction - maybe I need to move on to a new forum...... 'sniff'

Cloudraker

[squamish climber]

Cloudraker et al

We haven't made any decision on requiring people to put their real names on posts. My own opinion is that I think people should stand behind their statements, especially when they are being critical of someone or making allegations. But I don't think the community forum will work or grow if we make posting with your real name a requirement.

A couple solutions have been suggested so far that would allow anonymity to continue but may help in curbing some of the more grievous posts.

Let's hear from more of you.

[Tricouni]

One forum to which I contibute has a very nice feature. When you are logged in and click on some thread that you are following, there is a "go to first unread post" button. This saves much time if you only check a busy discussion once in a while and you've forgetten where you were.

Glenn