Squamish ratings???

[Tenn]

First post here. Gave up on the gripped bb. At least you guys talk about climbing.

Early yds ratings are certainly suspect when compared against modern ones. This is true in Yos as well as numerous other areas (how about the Valhallas for a BC example).

As for Squamish being soft...I think Sentry box was originally graded 5.11a - now its 12a - and I think that is a reflection of the fact that the FFA had no idea how hard this route really was (he just knew it was hard). I think (though I don't know because I've never been on it) that Clean Corner is quite a Squamish sandbag at 5.8.

From the little time I spent climbing in Yos I can't really offer a decisive argument. I climbed 5.10d that I thought was easier than exasperator and 10d that was harder than partners in crime. Of course my first day there I got spanked on 5.9 that was the worst run-out, funky, pin scarred excuse for a crack I've ever seen.

I think FFA dates will tell you alot about that 5.6 you are about to climb.

In conclusion, Squamish is generally regarded as soft by valley locals and other hard men (and women). Luckily, I don't count myself among that group and will be stoked as hell when I redpoint crime of the century (coming soon).

[MCpl]

I'm glad that early on in the thread someone made clear that they were stating that they were only talking about Squamish trad routes being "soft".

Why I wanted to mention that is that it is of the opinion of some that the bouldering is sandbagged.

[MCpl]

No. I'm saying that some ppl have suggested that the bouldering is sandbagged.

[psychedelic]

The bouldering rateings... you know most people I know call them soft. Yet I have gotten worked on some stuff that wasn't near as hard as I have sent! I think Squish bouldering is all over the place and when I did most the stuff I didn't know what was what. Bouldering is too much ones own stregnths... Slopers are a mother fucker! My main issue was moving dynamicly tho. I like climbing static.

Calling yosemite a sandbag and squamish more accurate... that will never make sense to me personally, so I can't even come up with a response.

I will say that many of the Index climbs were that single group and that it is pretty damn consistant there. Where as Yosemite and Squamish are just so many people and eras. Ratings are just all over the place. But overall Squamish is gotten soft compared to many places. So another thing to throw out that you guys would probably know.

Is Squamish getting softer or stiffer on the new stuff? I'd think it would begin to get more accurate now that there are so many people climbing there.

[Pete L.]

How about the sport ratings?

[tattooed_climber]

does it really matter? A 5.10 finger spliter feels totally different than a 5.10 OW...so whats the big deal if the squish granite is rated different than the granite in yose...after all, there's a 30hr drive or whatnot inbetween

[Tenn]

Just read Scott Milton's article in the latest gripped and it made me think a bit more about grading in Squamish and the sanbag/soft grade debate.

My question is: what crack routes in Squamish are good "benchmarks" for yds grades like 5.9, 5.10a, 5.11a and beyond? Sport climbers can include sport routes too.

From what I can tell Penny Lane seeems like a good 5.9, maybe apron strings could be a good 10a (or is it really 5.9 too?). Perspective seems honest at 11a to me too but maybe its not that hard and is just strenuous.

Any body have any thoughts on this?

[Tenn]

Mutation is a great route from what I remember. Seems harder than the .11c just left of "everyone's first .12a" at the circus wall. Sorry, don't remember the names but you know where I mean right?

What about the right side of the pillar? Should it be 5.9? Heard that before.

More questions for the hard trad climbers (sorry but that's what I like):
What are the biggest soft routes at squamish? - COTC
and what should they really be rated? - COTC = 5.11a?
What are some "benchmark" routes at Squamish?
What are some of the biggest sandbags (if there are any) at Squamish?

I guess my underlying question is: do some areas get labelled as soft because people with highly developed crack climbing skills go there and find all the crack climbing easy?

I would go out on a limb and say that the sport climbing in Squamish is pretty honest - pet wall for example.

And the bouldering is pretty hard - V2 spankings for all...

[MCpl]

How about this question. I'm learning to place gear this spring and the goal is to onsight 5.12a trad by the end of the season. Which route would you reccomend???

[erock]

hrmmm.. onsight a 12a trad climb. How about sentry box. i hear it's a soft one. I would have to say i'd be impressed if you managed to learn the skill of placing gear to the extent that you could onsight a 12a.
Good luck to yah

[5.4 Slayer]

Hey Marty, you could drag me up Freeway as your warm-up. I think you owe me one anyway.