Soloist on Diedre
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tangledfeet
- Casual Observer
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 3:29 pm
Morons abound.
Same thing happened on Snake yesterday. I was two party's up on the climb. Soloist was climbing when the guy in the group below me fell. Fortunately, no collision.
I respect free soloing but 5.9 trade routes seem to be the wrong area. Go early go late or more wisely go on non-trade routes that beginners do not frequent. I have seen water bottles, cams, nuts and tons of other goodies dropped. It would be a dumb way to make it in the papers.
"Great climber falls on easy route and dies after getting nailed by water bottle. New climber feels like sh*t for dropping bottle."
The guy was a kid in his early twenties and had to ask if the top was the end of the route. Mom must be proud.
Same thing happened on Snake yesterday. I was two party's up on the climb. Soloist was climbing when the guy in the group below me fell. Fortunately, no collision.
I respect free soloing but 5.9 trade routes seem to be the wrong area. Go early go late or more wisely go on non-trade routes that beginners do not frequent. I have seen water bottles, cams, nuts and tons of other goodies dropped. It would be a dumb way to make it in the papers.
"Great climber falls on easy route and dies after getting nailed by water bottle. New climber feels like sh*t for dropping bottle."
The guy was a kid in his early twenties and had to ask if the top was the end of the route. Mom must be proud.
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Squamishmonkey
- Junior Member
- Posts: 86
- Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 3:47 pm
- Location: Squamish
conflict
Brendan....I think you missed my point.
Being scared or not scared of conflict is irrelevant.
The point being that engaging the soloist on confrontation will not change his mind.....when was the last time someone agreed with you because you shouted at them?
"Who do I think will win when the conflict arrises?"
Are you serious? This is not the school yard. I have no idea who would win a fight and again is totally irrelevant to this discussion.
If you want to discuss soloing ethics then I will engage you in conversation.
I happen to agree that soloist should have a respect for others and think carefully about their actions, especially when it effects others. As should every type of climber. There are many better ways to spread understanding of what is and isn't acceptable to the rest of the climbing community. This forum being one of them.
Being scared or not scared of conflict is irrelevant.
The point being that engaging the soloist on confrontation will not change his mind.....when was the last time someone agreed with you because you shouted at them?
"Who do I think will win when the conflict arrises?"
Are you serious? This is not the school yard. I have no idea who would win a fight and again is totally irrelevant to this discussion.
If you want to discuss soloing ethics then I will engage you in conversation.
I happen to agree that soloist should have a respect for others and think carefully about their actions, especially when it effects others. As should every type of climber. There are many better ways to spread understanding of what is and isn't acceptable to the rest of the climbing community. This forum being one of them.
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Squamishmonkey
- Junior Member
- Posts: 86
- Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 3:47 pm
- Location: Squamish
Yes...my misunderstanding......i thought you meant in the parking lot or when ever you saw him afterwards.
I now see the humour in your statement.
A simple solution to alot of this is to simply not alow the soloist to pass until you feel he/she is not endangering you and your party. It is the lead partys right to say no and get the soloist to wait on a ledge lower until your ready. If he has to wait 30min on a ledge while you get set up then maybe he will think twice about soloing on the busy routes on the busy days.
It gets the message across and you don't even have to change anything you were doing.....Smile and say no...i'll let you know when i'm comfortable being passed.....and lead away.
I now see the humour in your statement.
A simple solution to alot of this is to simply not alow the soloist to pass until you feel he/she is not endangering you and your party. It is the lead partys right to say no and get the soloist to wait on a ledge lower until your ready. If he has to wait 30min on a ledge while you get set up then maybe he will think twice about soloing on the busy routes on the busy days.
It gets the message across and you don't even have to change anything you were doing.....Smile and say no...i'll let you know when i'm comfortable being passed.....and lead away.
True enough and we would probably have done so, but we were at the end of the line, waiting at the very first set of bolts and the fellow just walked right past us up the easy slab.
We watched him 'sneak up' on two parties. Had I been one of the climbers or belayers I certainly would have told him to wait where he is, but I guess these other folks felt they didn't have the right.
At any rate, equally surprising to me, was the fact that (from what I could tell, anyway) neither of the belayers on either team warned the leader that someone was coming up on them. Both times I saw the leader turn around and look surprised when the soloist came upon them, providing the gist of my assumption.
It should have been the belayers in each case that told the climber not to proceed, in my opinion. They at least have the time and the mental focus to spare. The leader should just be left to leading, in my world. I know had that fellow come up to me sniffing my butt like that it would have changed the game, mentally.
We watched him 'sneak up' on two parties. Had I been one of the climbers or belayers I certainly would have told him to wait where he is, but I guess these other folks felt they didn't have the right.
At any rate, equally surprising to me, was the fact that (from what I could tell, anyway) neither of the belayers on either team warned the leader that someone was coming up on them. Both times I saw the leader turn around and look surprised when the soloist came upon them, providing the gist of my assumption.
It should have been the belayers in each case that told the climber not to proceed, in my opinion. They at least have the time and the mental focus to spare. The leader should just be left to leading, in my world. I know had that fellow come up to me sniffing my butt like that it would have changed the game, mentally.
i agree w/ the leader being the one to decide who goes first!!
on a side note...
i decided to go climbing w/ my friend on tuesday, and it was getting late, so we chose to run up the Grand...
well, we ripped up to the base of the pillar only to be held up by two french guys from montreal who had been sitting there for like an hour! so as always, they got to go first. but after 45 mins waiting, he eventually got to the top of the pitch (and no, he wasn't dogging, he was liebacking the whole way up and enjoying it), but we decided to bail. and good thing we did, cause by the time we rapped down, got to the car, ate something and began to drive away, the leader just got to the top of the sword... lol...
so i don't know how my story has to do w/ this topic, but i guess the leader can decide who goes ahead, even if the party below is soloing... ??
on a side note...
i decided to go climbing w/ my friend on tuesday, and it was getting late, so we chose to run up the Grand...
well, we ripped up to the base of the pillar only to be held up by two french guys from montreal who had been sitting there for like an hour! so as always, they got to go first. but after 45 mins waiting, he eventually got to the top of the pitch (and no, he wasn't dogging, he was liebacking the whole way up and enjoying it), but we decided to bail. and good thing we did, cause by the time we rapped down, got to the car, ate something and began to drive away, the leader just got to the top of the sword... lol...
so i don't know how my story has to do w/ this topic, but i guess the leader can decide who goes ahead, even if the party below is soloing... ??
The same thing happened to my wife and I two years ago on Diedre, except there were two soloists, (idiots), both wearing headphones and completely oblivious to everything outside of their own little world. They both literally climbed around my wife as she was seconding the first pitch. We were completely flabbergasted at the disregard for others' safety and enjoyment of a wonderful climb. It totally ruined our day. We bailed. I just don't get what guys like that are thinking. It seems completely selfish, egotistical and irresponsible to pull sh*t like that. I hope I never see a display like that again. On the whole, the climbing community is a very pleasant one, but I guess every being has an A$%^#@. My two cents.
oh, dear......
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